Disabled and pensioner concessionary passes under threat

[TimBrown]

Here is a link to Daily Mail article highlighting lack of Government funding of local councils for concessionary passes and marginal routes. Does it mean that bus passes are at risk?

If so we can expect more heavy service cuts in this area in the not too distant future.

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/articl ... asses.html

[AdamH]

This problem has been known about for a long time. The free pass scheme has been so popular the local authorities are running out of money and can’t afford to subsidise routes that are not profitable.

The pass scheme is written in law so it can’t be changed without an act of parliament. The result will be pensioners in rural areas will have a free pass but there will be no bus for them to use it on.

[DD12]

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-47182101

What an e*fFing mess !!

I'm not a fan of the Labour Party's IMAGE of "just throwing huge amounts of money at problems", but I'd almost welcome them getting back in-power !!

[MattW]

It seems like a complete mess. I'm not generally an advocate of nationalisation, but surely if the passes are funded out of the public purse, it would make sense for the buses to be too? Or is this oversimplified?

[bringstybeast]

As a non-pensioner - my obersvation was that the leisure use significantly increased once it came in nationally. So, using a summer 420 as an example - Hereford council would be paying X amount for 40-odd “Brummie” pensioners (on a really busy day) to have a day out. They’d take up all of the fixed seats on the bus, whilst any able bodied FARE PAYERS had to stand.

In said example, council is subsidising a day trip for people outside the county. Fare payers feel peeved and look for alternatives to the bus. Actual reimbursement is less per passenger than the fare would be, so then possible that a full bus going 30 miles with all free-passes going end to end doesn’t actually make a profit. So the *commercial* service gets cut back, until it becomes unviable - and then it’s down to the council to see if it has any money left to fund it.

It would be so annoying if it weren’t all so blatently obvious beforehand!

If, rather than free was a token fare of 50p per journey - would lose a lot of daytrippers who then see a cost, and also those who sit and ride on the bus all day (there are a few) - so take up might have been lower - closer to what was assumed in the first place?

If, rather than nationwide free travel, it was restricted to resident local authority plus maybe neighbouring local authorities - it would reduce the amount it subsidised long distance tourism, whilst keeping the benefit for local travel to shops, library, doctors - for which it was intended.

Too late to put it back in the box. No government would want to throw away the votes either...

Sad to say it, but we (here) are past the point of having a sufficently useable bus service to live without a car - and I say with 18 years experience in a 0 car family 5 miles from Bromyard. I have a car now... (and used the bus here just once in last 7 years... is there still a 5 hr gap between buses in middle of the day?? Daytime buses are no more full than when it ran hourly)

[AdamH]

I ran the last 351 from Gloucester to Tewkesbury tonight. A little surprised to see a woman get on with an OAP Explorer ticket. Very little point to this ticket on a Saturday because the free pass does the same job. They are mostly only used in the week before 0930. Halfway round the route she was the only person on the bus and came to the front to try and see her stop in the dark. She said she was worried about bus cuts and had therefore chosen to pay for a ticket whenever she could to try and do her bit.

If only others were like her the Councils might be in with a chance. I’m not saying everyone with a pass should pay as many OAPs are very much on the breadline, but clearly some can afford to do so... Means testing? It’s a can of worms, but I think it’s the fairest option.

[chason]

I think Adam's got a good point here but I am not sure that you could persuade enough to pay to make a significant difference. There is a feeling amongst people of my age group that they have paid their taxes over the years to enjoy a few concessions in their declining years. I have to admit that, although I could afford to pay, I do claim the Senior Citizen rate when buying theatre and concert tickets, reductions in restaurants, discounts in shops etc., where these are offered.

The difference of course is that with all those, I still have to pay a significant proportion of the cost whereas concessionary bus travel is absolutely free. I don't think it would be unreasonable to expect concessionary pass holders to pay a contribution, perhaps half the normal fare, I accept that some pensioners would not be able to afford it but I feel that this should be tackled through pension credits or the like through means testing.

The problem for politicians is that the pensioner vote is very significant (and growing) so any political party whittling away at these sort of benefits might well suffer at the ballot box. I have just qualified for a free TV licence but the government, rather than abolishing it, has totally unfairly shifted responsibility for it to the BBC. Expecting that organisation to adopt the burden of social costs is just as unreasonable as bus companies subsidising concessionary travel. Either they should be paid for through taxation, the beneficiary should make a contribution or a combination of both.

[bmmoboy]

Some pensioners abuse the system, not many, but I have heard stories about people who come into Worcester on a daily basis, whether they need to or not "I use the bus pass daily as I don't want to lose it" or I use the bus pass every day because it is free" are just two comments I have heard. Other abuses of the system in include one person who travels from one end of the road to the other, (about half a mile) up to five times a day. If there was a 50p charge for each journey, this would help the council's coffers, reduce unnecessary journeys a hopefully keep the concessionary scheme in place.

[TimBrown]

I ran the last 351 from Gloucester to Tewkesbury tonight. A little surprised to see a woman get on with an OAP Explorer ticket. Very little point to this ticket on a Saturday because the free pass does the same job. They are mostly only used in the week before 0930. Halfway round the route she was the only person on the bus and came to the front to try and see her stop in the dark. She said she was worried about bus cuts and had therefore chosen to pay for a ticket whenever she could to try and do her bit.

If only others were like her the Councils might be in with a chance. I’m not saying everyone with a pass should pay as many OAPs are very much on the breadline, but clearly some can afford to do so... Means testing? It’s a can of worms, but I think it’s the fairest option.

I was means tested for a number of years on Pension credit when unable to find suitable employment as a 60 year old disabled man. Means testing means declaring the amount of money you have in Current Account, Savings ISAs, Stocks and Shares, income from pension funds and any income from part time zero hours contracts. You can't hide anything as the National Insurance Number is a dead give away. Woe betide anyone doing a bit of cash work on the side like painting, gardening or car repairs!. Point being that everything is exposed to some unnamed person or persons, so means testing means no privacy.

The attached link is more to the point;
https://www.ftadviser.com/pensions/2018 ... ped-world/

As you can see Britain has just about the worst State Pensions in Europe as a proportion of average pay, and worse than many poor countries worldwide. Considering Britain is allegedly the sixth wealthiest nation in the world it is nothing short of a scandal! If you are not retired yet and hope to survive on a State pension when you finish work, just consider you will receive £160 per week today, or thereabouts, provided you have made sufficient NI contributions in your career. I guess an average bus driver will gross £400,
or more, per week, but remember if you have a works pension this will be taxed just the same when you are a pensioner if you are lucky enough to gross £11,600 or more. Many pensions from previous employment and those from private Insurance schemes only pay out a static fixed sum for as long as you live. The First Bus pension has been known to pay as much as 7 pence a week increase some years in my case on a four year plan, with nothing in many years. If you are lucky enough to have saved say £100,000 lump sum for retirement it will only earn 1.5% annual interest in a safe ISA or about £30 per week without eating into the capital as I had to do on Pension Credit some years back. If my State pension was half average pay i.e. £250 per week, I wouldn't need to use the bus and therefore be quite prepared to pay the normal adult rover fare in emergencies. As bus services have progressively worsened in the Worcester area with no improvement on the horizon, I will, however, keep my car for as long as possible for the sheer convenience and independence it gives, even if it means raiding my savings.